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难翻的词 (The English words that are very difficult to translate into Chinese)
Thread poster: Zhoudan
redred
redred  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 02:22
English to Chinese
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不公平 Apr 16, 2009

以前的大学生,素质就是高。企业的退休高工(以前的大学生)却不及机关看门人的退休金。

 
ysun
ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:22
English to Chinese
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可怜的要求 Apr 27, 2009

redred wrote:

企业的退休高工(以前的大学生)却不及机关看门人的退休金。

原以为 redred 说的只是极个别特殊情况,但最近收到国内校友来信后才知那是普遍现象。 不久前,上海国有企业781名具有高级职称的退休科技人员联名致信中共上海市委俞正声书记。 该信的主要内容是关于退休待遇问题。他们在信的最后提出四点要求,其中第二点要求如下:

(二)第一步在今年内,将企业全体退休高级职称科技人员的养老待遇提高到机关退休驾驶员、门卫的相同水平(含共享费和补充养老金在内)。今年已是我们向市委、市政府提出这一请求的第四年了。


 
ysun
ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:22
English to Chinese
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translation of idioms Aug 12, 2009

I think the best translation of a Chinese idiom would be an equivalent English idiom.

成语“火中取栗”出自十七世纪法国寓言诗人拉•封丹(Jean de La Fontaine)的寓言《猴子与猫》(Monkey and Cat)。大意是猴子骗猫火中取栗,结果栗子让猴子给吃了,猫却把脚上的毛给烧掉了。

In the Chinese-English Dictionary, “火中取栗” is translated into:
1. pull chestnuts out of the fire -- gain profit in risk<
... See more
I think the best translation of a Chinese idiom would be an equivalent English idiom.

成语“火中取栗”出自十七世纪法国寓言诗人拉•封丹(Jean de La Fontaine)的寓言《猴子与猫》(Monkey and Cat)。大意是猴子骗猫火中取栗,结果栗子让猴子给吃了,猫却把脚上的毛给烧掉了。

In the Chinese-English Dictionary, “火中取栗” is translated into:
1. pull chestnuts out of the fire -- gain profit in risk
2. be a cat's paw

I feel the essence of the Chinese idiom was lost in translation. I am wondering if there is an equivalent English idiom for “火中取栗”?
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wherestip
wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:22
Chinese to English
+ ...
火中取栗 Aug 12, 2009

ysun wrote:

I think the best translation of a Chinese idiom would be an equivalent English idiom.

成语“火中取栗”出自十七世纪法国寓言诗人拉•封丹(Jean de La Fontaine)的寓言《猴子与猫》(Monkey and Cat)。大意是猴子骗猫火中取栗,结果栗子让猴子给吃了,猫却把脚上的毛给烧掉了。

In the Chinese-English Dictionary, “火中取栗” is translated into:
1. pull chestnuts out of the fire -- gain profit in risk
2. be a cat's paw

I feel the essence of the Chinese idiom was lost in translation. I am wondering if there is an equivalent English idiom for “火中取栗”?


Yueyin,

I'm not sure if this counts as an idiom, but there's the common saying of "getting someone else to do your dirty work".

Is that the aspect of 火中取栗 you are thinking of?


 
wherestip
wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:22
Chinese to English
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unnecessary risks Aug 12, 2009

I usually think of the chinese idiom 火中取栗 as taking on unnecessary risks. That could be another situation where the term is often used, perhaps?


Getting back to the meaning of having someone else do one's dirty work, there's the name "jackal" for the latter. The word is definitely not complimentary though....
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I usually think of the chinese idiom 火中取栗 as taking on unnecessary risks. That could be another situation where the term is often used, perhaps?


Getting back to the meaning of having someone else do one's dirty work, there's the name "jackal" for the latter. The word is definitely not complimentary though.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/jackal

–noun
1. any of several nocturnal wild dogs of the genus Canis, esp. C. aureus, of Asia and Africa, that scavenge or hunt in packs.
2. a person who performs dishonest or base deeds as the follower or accomplice of another.
3. a person who performs menial or degrading tasks for another.
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wherestip
wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:22
Chinese to English
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Jump through hoops? Aug 12, 2009

That's another possible interpretation that comes to mind - meaning to go through a lot of trouble to accomplish something. Of course this doesn't have anything to do with the role the cat plays.

 
wherestip
wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:22
Chinese to English
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To trick someone into doing something demeaning or undesirable to benefit oneself Aug 12, 2009

To find a sucker, find a patsy ...

Okay, that's all the different shades of meaning I can think of for now



[Edited at 2009-08-12 11:37 GMT]


 
ysun
ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:22
English to Chinese
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Cat's paw Aug 12, 2009

Steve,

Thank you for your suggestions. I think some of your suggestions are very good. After a further research, I found that "Cat's paw" did come from the same fable: THE MONKEY USES THE CAT S PAW. Probably, the best translation of “火中取栗" is still “be a Cat's paw”.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/cat's%20paw

Idioms & Phrases
cat's paw
A dupe or tool for another, a sucker, as in You always try to make a cat's paw of me, but I refuse to do any more of your work. This term alludes to a very old tale about a monkey that persuades a cat to pull chestnuts out of the fire so as to avoid burning its own paws. The story dates from the 16th century and versions of it (some with a dog) exist in many languages.


http://www.crazyenglish.org/xuexi/cihui/2009/0311/47011.html

Cat’s paw从字面意义上看是“猫的爪子”,实际上却有着独特的含义,意为“受人利用者”。奇怪,像猫这么头脑聪明爪子尖锐的动物,怎么倒会受人利用呢?
  无论在神话传说还是在寓言故事中,猫都被描绘成一种机敏灵巧,足智多谋,甚至有点狡诈老练的动物。
  但cat's paw却是一个例外,它源自一个《火中取栗》的寓言:狡猾的猴子哄骗头脑简单的猫,让猫替它从炉火中取出烤熟的栗子来。馋嘴的猫儿应命去做,爪子上的毛都被火烧掉了,结果它辛辛苦苦取出的栗子却被猴子悄悄吃光了,自己什么也没吃到。聪明的猫毕竟也有失算的时候,因此cat's paw就有了“因无知而受人利用,被人当工具”的含义。不过最早的cat's paw多指某人因不清楚状况而被骗去做一些危险的傻事,而现在cat's paw的意义则更广泛了,“受人利用者”可能已经很清楚自己的角色了,但还是甘当工具为虎作伥。
  火中取栗这个典故最早出于公元前三世纪的《伊索寓言》,后来在17世纪,法国著名寓言作家拉•封丹将它改写成《猴子与猫》,cat's paw的喻意也从此广为流传,并演化为catspaw或cats paw。
  来看一个例句:It is easy for him to be used as a cat's paw of evil-doing.(他很容易就被人利用,成为别人为非作歹的工具。)
来源:中国日报网站

Please also see THE MONKEY USES THE CAT S PAW:

http://books.google.com/books?id=jZkXAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA143&lpg=PA143&dq="THE%20MONKEY%20USES%20THE%20CAT'S+PAW+%22&source=bl&ots=f5e06iG6rx&sig=cCEZW2qMvzL6sqn-zwMgfBFPTzg&hl=en&ei=-buCSvGBDouwtgfq0pXLCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1#v=onepage&q=%22THE%20MONKEY%20USES%20THE%20CAT'S%20PAW%20%22&f=false


 
wherestip
wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:22
Chinese to English
+ ...
被人利用 Aug 12, 2009

ysun wrote:

Steve,

Thank you for your suggestions. I think some of your suggestions are very good. After a further research, I found that "Cat's paw" did come from the same fable: THE MONKEY USES THE CAT S PAW. Probably, the best translation of “火中取栗" is still “be a Cat's paw”.



Definitely. I was just going by my own instinct on what the Chinese idiom meant ... didn't bother to do a search or anything. I agree that "a cat's paw" is very descriptive, though I haven't heard of the expression before.

Here's another site's definition of "a cat's-paw" ...

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cat's-paw



1. A person used by another as a dupe or tool.

...

Noun 1. cat's-paw - a person used by another to gain an end
pawn, instrument
assistant, helper, help, supporter - a person who contributes to the fulfillment of a need or furtherance of an effort or purpose; "my invaluable assistant"; "they hired additional help to finish the work"





[Edited at 2009-08-12 20:25 GMT]


 
CHEN-Ling
CHEN-Ling  Identity Verified
Local time: 02:22
Chinese to English
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上善若水 Aug 13, 2009

“上善若水”,是说水具有滋养万物生命的德性。它能使万物得到它的利益,而不与万物争利,故天下最大的善性莫如水。正如古人所说的:“到江送客棹,出岳润民田。”凡是能利物、利人之事,水都尽力去为。水的这种特性,可谓之“上善”。
http://zhidao.baidu.com/question/63094.html
国学大师林语堂的翻译
The highest excellence is like that of water


 
pkchan
pkchan  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 14:22
Member (2006)
English to Chinese
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網上翻 Aug 13, 2009

"上善若水"缘水而居的东方哲学The highest good is like that of water ... - [ Translate this page ]上善若水"缘水而居的东方哲学The highest good is like that of water: Oriental philosophy about residing along water 期刊环境ENVIRONMENT 2005年第04期 ...
www.ilib.com.cn/A-huanj200504027.html - Similar -
“上善若水”翻译成英语是什么? - 天涯�
... See more
"上善若水"缘水而居的东方哲学The highest good is like that of water ... - [ Translate this page ]上善若水"缘水而居的东方哲学The highest good is like that of water: Oriental philosophy about residing along water 期刊环境ENVIRONMENT 2005年第04期 ...
www.ilib.com.cn/A-huanj200504027.html - Similar -
“上善若水”翻译成英语是什么? - 天涯问答 - [ Translate this page ]上善若水The highest good is like water. 地势坤,君子以厚德载物。 The earth's condition is receptive devotion. Thus the superior man who has breadth of ...
wenda.tianya.cn/wenda/thread?tid=5a8878fbef7a92b2... - Cached - Similar -
“上善若水,厚德载物”用英语怎么翻译? - 已回答- 天涯问答 - [ Translate this page ]上善若水The highest good is like water. 地势坤,君子以厚德载物。 The earth's condition is receptive devotion. ...
wenda.tianya.cn/wenda/thread?tid=47ab1ff19b48e63a... - Cached - Similar -
The Highest Good -- Tao Te Ching - StumbleUponAug 6, 2006 ... From the page: "The highest good is like water. Water gives life to the ten thousand things and does not strive. ...
www.stumbleupon.com/url/www.../The_Highest_Good.html - Cached - Similar -
The Highest Good is Like Water - Seasons of Peace Cooperation CirclesThe Highest Good is Like Water - from Seasons of Peace Cooperation Circles - a space to nurture the development of a sustainable culture of peace.
www.seasons-of-peace.net/tao-te-ching/highest.htm - Cached - Similar -
Comments on the Tao Te ChingVerse 20: "Highest good is like water." The supreme yin image of the Tao: Water. Nothing

[修改时间: 2009-08-13 19:40 GMT]
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CHEN-Ling
CHEN-Ling  Identity Verified
Local time: 02:22
Chinese to English
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那啥 Aug 14, 2009

东北人口头禅。
1.你看你那啥得瑟的。
2.那啥,你咋不吐口唾沫淹死呢?
3.那啥的那啥,因为那啥,所以那啥,不管怎样那啥,我都要那啥...
看到这样的句子我当场晕菜。
读第3句的感觉就像搅一锅粥。那个“得瑟”、“晕菜”也不好翻。


 
wonita (X)
wonita (X)
China
Local time: 15:22
臭美 Aug 14, 2009

A stinky beauty?

Does anybody have a better suggestion?


 
wherestip
wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 13:22
Chinese to English
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stinkin' beauty Aug 14, 2009

Bin Tiede wrote:

臭美

A stinky beauty?

Does anybody have a better suggestion?




有那么翻的吗? 那 "屎壳郎戴花臭美" 怎么办哪?

英文说法很多: vain and pretentious, showy, show-offish, ostentatious 之类的说法都行.




http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/vain

vain
–adjective
1. excessively proud of or concerned about one's own appearance, qualities, achievements, etc.; conceited: a vain dandy.




http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/narcissistic

narcissistic
–noun
1. inordinate fascination with oneself; excessive self-love; vanity.
2. Psychoanalysis. erotic gratification derived from admiration of one's own physical or mental attributes, being a normal condition at the infantile level of personality development.




http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pretentious

pretentious
-adj.
2. Making or marked by an extravagant outward show; ostentatious.




 
wonita (X)
wonita (X)
China
Local time: 15:22
屎壳郎戴花臭美 Aug 15, 2009

wherestip wrote:

有那么翻的吗? 那 "屎壳郎戴花臭美" 怎么办哪?



A dung beetle wears a flower - a stinky beauty!


 
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难翻的词 (The English words that are very difficult to translate into Chinese)






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